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Author Topic: The Bard - PrClass/Items/Organizations/NPCs  (Read 5071 times)
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Reideen
Heepa-Heepa


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To win, means to sacrifice.


« on: August 14, 2006, 01:03:27 PM »

Well...as a fan of the bard class I was relativley sad that there was no similar class in Midnight.And I didn't saw anything like that so I started to develop a bard prestige class for Midnight...
I would love some comments so that we might balance out the class or take on some corrections.
I'm going to do some extra informations like Organizations and Items.
Planing on foldable or reinforced instruments and an Organization called "The Chord"

I liked the Tier abilities of the defender and the wildlander so I tried to copied a bit, even thought its just a 10 lvl. prestige class.

* PrestigeClass - Bard.doc (41 KB - downloaded 336 times.)
« Last Edit: August 14, 2006, 01:06:52 PM by Reideen » Logged

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Reideen
Heepa-Heepa


Spell Energy / Taint +0/-0
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To win, means to sacrifice.


« Reply #1 on: August 14, 2006, 01:32:50 PM »

Foldable Instrument

Even thought bards are musicians they can’t have large harps or lutes on their back when traveling. Warriors have foldable weapons so the bards copied the idea individually. Foldable Instruments can be put up in about one minute if done quickly. But this has its effect on the quality of the instrument and you must take a -5 penality on the performance.
Most of the times bards take their time to put up their instruments but they’re still not as good as normal ones and you must still take a -2 penality.

A foldable instruments cost as much as a masterwork instrument.


Reinforced Instrument

A reinforced instrument is meant to be used as weapon in dire times. It is still not as durable as a weapon. It has a hardness of 5 and 10 hitpoints. A lute may be used as a club, a small flute like a dagger and so on. What damage the weapon makes and what kind of damage it does is up to the DM.
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Nifelhein
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« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2006, 02:07:43 PM »

Well, there was a bard prestige class in the Tome of Sorrows, but no official one has been made so far, yes, mainly because the idea of a bard is somewhat out of place in Midnight, there is no right to travel, read and write and real life stories or even fantastic ones will very ofte be seen as insurgent and the person executed.

The other races haev no time for this kind fo thing either. Making a bard for Midnight means making a new concept before making a set of rules for it. Now to the thing.

Skills: Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Hide, Jump, all Knowledges, Listen, Move Silently, Sleight of Hand, Spot, Swim, Tumble, Use Magic Device and Use Rope have no reason to be on the lsit at all, you could possibly let Knowledge (arcana, history and spirits) on the list, but nothing else. Speak language is not a standard skill in Midnight and should not figue in a list at all, they have a very perculiar set of rules on them, you might give the class some bonuses to spend on languages though, or more flexible limits. Disguise I can see a reason to be added but don't really think it is needed, the skill may be used untrained and msot people will hardly go beyond that. Likewise 6 skill points is not very common, but may fit if the class is more focused on skills than the base class it is meant to boost in a focus.

later I will coment the second post. Wink

Proficiencies: if they get no penalty to wear light armor, they should get proficiency with them, the weapon list is stylish but has no real reason to be though, unless you are aiming to mimic the core rule's bard.

Bardic Knowledge: this ability is what the hermetic channelers have as their tradition gift and should not be made available elsewhere unless the class is focused for that tradition, if you keep this the end result will be a charismatc channeler that ahs the same basic ability of the hermetic one in addition to his own gifts.

Improved Spellcasting: the class gets a lot of customized spells in the list and has a good set of abilities, I would not give them 1 new known spell every level, perhaps 1 every two levels, but not every level. Check the Snow Witch from the Sorcery & Shadow sourcebook for an idea on how this could be done.

Craft Charm: I would rename this to Folk Tools and give it sooner, the ability is not very powerful and is also dependent on other skills/feats to work well.

Bard Abilities: I also love the tier thing but this is not a bse class, the defender gets 7 of his abilites through 10 levels and the wildlander gets 8, the class gets 5 and has a wide range to choose from, this sounds a little too much, specially when podenring the skill list, number per level and other abilities, the class stands as a rather powerful one, high above others.

Spell Focus (Enchantment): This seems like a core concept of the class, I would move it to the requirements in that case and not give it as a bonus, and even if it is kept as a bonus, gaining it at 7th level (minimum character level 13) is way high to make it really worth.

Charm Knowledge: Too powerful there is a fet that grants charm knowledge at every level but it does not grant more if takena t higher levels, I would just give the class that feat for free at 1st or 2nd level and tat is that.

inspire Leadership: The nae is not really good, somethign like Spread the word would be more interesting and fitting, th mechanics are too open, if the group has 5 characters then the bard would not need to tell anyone else of the tales, I would say he ahs to spread the tale wherever he goes, that means telling it to a number of people arge enough to make it somewhat known on the area, that ldeadership bonus would then apply to the area or those who come from it. Leave the amount and other specifics to individual DMs.

Individual bard abilities: ventriloquism is not really needed unless it is magical in nature or somehow surpasses the bluff skill that could be used, restricting the class to instuments is unecessary, some bards would sing, others would make speeches, let them choose, all of those would be amde through perform and have words or music tied to it, at any rate the prince charming fuills the role of boosting the perform check well enough and i woudl not let it be taken twice in a row, though twice could be fine. So Master of X Instrument is uncessary and I would reduc the bonus from Pricne Charming on seduction to +3, to avoid having a character turn every roleplayign opportunity into a sexual harassment attempt.

Extra Charm is a wek ability if compared to the other ones, I would just drop it, granting whisper awareness would be a nice touch if the class was a man of languages and master of many world's, he isn't really that, so why bother? Leave whsiper to elves and those attuned to nature.

Lucky is another feat, perhaps making it into the charm knowledge ability woudl work, let that ability ragnt the two feats, perhap at 3rd or 4th level, not good enough to make anyone want to use a tier ability, in my opinion. fascinate is somewhat available to charismatic channelers arelady, as an use of their gift, perhap making ti another use of the gift would work, and you coudl very well have more of those new gift choices as tier abilities or change the tier abilities into new gift choices and grant gift abilites at the prestige class. Spell Instrument would work if you want to restrict bards to using instrument, but if you want singing and oratory to be available it may not fit well, it also seems a little too open on terms of whether the spell is casta dn can be interrupted as normal or not, it sounds somewhat like a scroll, so it woudl be use activation and be subject to disruption.

Voice of the songbird seems like a too high boost in my opinion, specially with prince charming beign available more than once. Share luck is not really sharing too, make his charms get a +1 luck bonus that stacks with the lucky feat but not other luck bonuses, or just make him able to use a charm that grants luck bonuses and grant half of that bonus, rounded down, to all allies within 30ft of him at the time of activation, minimum shared bonus equal to 1.

Penetrating voice could still be around but change requisites, you could change it to grant a new save against all spells and efefcts that prevent use of his charismatic tradiiton gifts and prestige class abilities, if the effect or spell dos not alow a savem he makes a dispel attempt, no retries allowed for a given effect.

Incredible Luck could be made to shar the very same bonus of the charm with all allies within 30ft upon activation, bonus from feats and the like should not be shared, same applies to the other ability.

I don't really like the ieda of an organization behind bards, but rather one made of them and with some values that help them stay alive and spread their knowledge of tales and/or songs.

I hope I do not make you feel like I nailed the class down to nothing, just that I think it can and has lots of room for improvement, mechanics are the part of it prone to abuse and powergaming so I haev given it special attention, but the background of the class in aryth sounds mostly okay, i think dwarves do have bards, they would mor often be lorekeepers, and that orcs do have them, miransil and danisil would lvoe them and halflings would have great ones. Wink
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"We cannot live only for ourselves. A thousand fibers connect us with our fellow men; and among those fibers, as sympathetic threads, our actions run as causes, and they come back to us as effects."
 - Attributed to Herman Melville.
Reideen
Heepa-Heepa


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Gender: Male
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To win, means to sacrifice.


« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2006, 06:46:40 PM »

Nono
Its absolutly okay
You see...it is the first time I actually tried to make a class of myself.
Everyone starts somewhere, somewhen. I never contributed to any system so I didn't thought that it would be glady welcomed *lol*

But thanks you reminded me where I actually saw the midnight bard...I thought I once saw one but couldn't remember where ^^"

Quote
Skills: Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Hide, Jump, all Knowledges, Listen, Move Silently, Sleight of Hand, Spot, Swim, Tumble, Use Magic Device and Use Rope have no reason to be on the lsit at all, you could possibly let Knowledge (arcana, history and spirits) on the list, but nothing else. Speak language is not a standard skill in Midnight and should not figue in a list at all, they have a very perculiar set of rules on them, you might give the class some bonuses to spend on languages though, or more flexible limits. Disguise I can see a reason to be added but don't really think it is needed, the skill may be used untrained and msot people will hardly go beyond that. Likewise 6 skill points is not very common, but may fit if the class is more focused on skills than the base class it is meant to boost in a focus.
Well there is still the rougish aspect of a bard I just emulated...I took the skill list from the basic bard and maybe that was a mistake. But still, I would keep Hide, Listen and Move Silently. First and third because of their need to hide since they are likely to attract the shadows attention more so than any defender because their primary job is illegal while defenders protect themselves behind normal jobs and occupations. And listen because a bard must have good ears.
As for speak language...even the barbarian has speak language as a class skill...so why shouldn't a bard have it ?

Quote
Proficiencies: if they get no penalty to wear light armor, they should get proficiency with them, the weapon list is stylish but has no real reason to be though, unless you are aiming to mimic the core rule's bard.
Aye...indeed...well all simple weapons should be okay after all.

Quote
Bardic Knowledge: this ability is what the hermetic channelers have as their tradition gift and should not be made available elsewhere unless the class is focused for that tradition, if you keep this the end result will be a charismatc channeler that ahs the same basic ability of the hermetic one in addition to his own gifts.
Right...I didn't thought of that. Well no problem...away with the bardic knowledge...you can change that or erase it completely. Maybe to a not so time consuming "Gather INformation" in form of gossips the bard has heard while he traveled.

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Improved Spellcasting: the class gets a lot of customized spells in the list and has a good set of abilities, I would not give them 1 new known spell every level, perhaps 1 every two levels, but not every level. Check the Snow Witch from the Sorcery & Shadow sourcebook for an idea on how this could be done.
Right...sounds good. I haven't really looked a the snow witch until now...

Quote
Craft Charm: I would rename this to Folk Tools and give it sooner, the ability is not very powerful and is also dependent on other skills/feats to work well.
Maybe sooner in exchange for the bardic knowledge

Quote
Bard Abilities: I also love the tier thing but this is not a bse class, the defender gets 7 of his abilites through 10 levels and the wildlander gets 8, the class gets 5 and has a wide range to choose from, this sounds a little too much, specially when podenring the skill list, number per level and other abilities, the class stands as a rather powerful one, high above others.
Hm...maybe revise the Abilities...or shorten them to 4...and maybe only 2 tiers, instead of 3.

Quote
Spell Focus (Enchantment): This seems like a core concept of the class, I would move it to the requirements in that case and not give it as a bonus, and even if it is kept as a bonus, gaining it at 7th level (minimum character level 13) is way high to make it really worth.

Mhm...indeed...

Quote
Charm Knowledge: Too powerful there is a fet that grants charm knowledge at every level but it does not grant more if takena t higher levels, I would just give the class that feat for free at 1st or 2nd level and tat is that.

maybe then at 2nd lvl. in exchange for the first ability.

Quote
inspire Leadership: The nae is not really good, somethign like Spread the word would be more interesting and fitting, th mechanics are too open, if the group has 5 characters then the bard would not need to tell anyone else of the tales, I would say he ahs to spread the tale wherever he goes, that means telling it to a number of people arge enough to make it somewhat known on the area, that ldeadership bonus would then apply to the area or those who come from it. Leave the amount and other specifics to individual DMs.
Well, some minor changes, but it is still the same concept, and one of the nicer class features I had in mind....

Quote
Individual bard abilities: ventriloquism is not really needed unless it is magical in nature or somehow surpasses the bluff skill that could be used, restricting the class to instuments is unecessary, some bards would sing, others would make speeches, let them choose, all of those would be amde through perform and have words or music tied to it, at any rate the prince charming fuills the role of boosting the perform check well enough and i woudl not let it be taken twice in a row, though twice could be fine. So Master of X Instrument is uncessary and I would reduc the bonus from Pricne Charming on seduction to +3, to avoid having a character turn every roleplayign opportunity into a sexual harassment attempt.
Yeah...in the afterlook ventriloquism seems pretty useless.
Well thats why I thought of the tier abilities. Bards that do not use instruments could take the more voice focusing abilities y'know.

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Extra Charm is a wek ability if compared to the other ones, I would just drop it, granting whisper awareness would be a nice touch if the class was a man of languages and master of many world's, he isn't really that, so why bother? Leave whsiper to elves and those attuned to nature.
Well...t'was a romantic thought that the bard may collect forgotten tales by the whispering of the dead.

Quote
Lucky is another feat, perhaps making it into the charm knowledge ability woudl work, let that ability ragnt the two feats, perhap at 3rd or 4th level, not good enough to make anyone want to use a tier ability, in my opinion.
What do you mean ?
Like putting Lucky and Charm Knowledge into a single ability ?


Quote
fascinate is somewhat available to charismatic channelers arelady, as an use of their gift, perhap making ti another use of the gift would work, and you coudl very well have more of those new gift choices as tier abilities or change the tier abilities into new gift choices and grant gift abilites at the prestige class.

Hmph...when I worked on it I've completly forgotten the channeler gifts...(may be because ours doesn't use his')
But sounds good for the rest...

Quote
Spell Instrument would work if you want to restrict bards to using instrument, but if you want singing and oratory to be available it may not fit well, it also seems a little too open on terms of whether the spell is casta dn can be interrupted as normal or not, it sounds somewhat like a scroll, so it woudl be use activation and be subject to disruption.
Thats what I meant...I tried to split the bard abilities into Instrument users and singer/storytellers...well...I should have taken more time, but its better to get me some help from here, aye ?

Quote
Voice of the songbird seems like a too high boost in my opinion, specially with prince charming beign available more than once. Share luck is not really sharing too, make his charms get a +1 luck bonus that stacks with the lucky feat but not other luck bonuses, or just make him able to use a charm that grants luck bonuses and grant half of that bonus, rounded down, to all allies within 30ft of him at the time of activation, minimum shared bonus equal to 1.

Maybe I should just throw the two abilities together...making it one (lets call it charming voice, then *lol*)
Mhm...after contributing I just thought of an similar effect. Would just be unfair for those who bought lucky, when all other chars could get their charms from the bard to get the same result.

Quote
Penetrating voice could still be around but change requisites, you could change it to grant a new save against all spells and efefcts that prevent use of his charismatic tradiiton gifts and prestige class abilities, if the effect or spell dos not alow a savem he makes a dispel attempt, no retries allowed for a given effect.
Fine with me ^^

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Incredible Luck could be made to shar the very same bonus of the charm with all allies within 30ft upon activation, bonus from feats and the like should not be shared, same applies to the other ability.
sounds pretty nice...one activation and serval benifitors...making him to a charm-machine *lol* ( Being equipped with thousands of unseeming items is pretty suspicious to me *lol*)

Quote
I don't really like the ieda of an organization behind bards, but rather one made of them and with some values that help them stay alive and spread their knowledge of tales and/or songs.
Well...its not a real organization...more like ...dunno how to say it.
In germany we would say "Interessengemeinschaft"...maybe translated with "society of similar interests"

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I hope I do not make you feel like I nailed the class down to nothing, just that I think it can and has lots of room for improvement, mechanics are the part of it prone to abuse and powergaming so I haev given it special attention,
Well yeah...got some work to do...but I don't want to abandon this project *lol*

Quote
but the background of the class in aryth sounds mostly okay, i think dwarves do have bards, they would mor often be lorekeepers, and that orcs do have them, miransil and danisil would love them and halflings would have great ones.
Yeah...dwarves would be lorekeepers, thats what I thought,too ...but I thought an orc bard more like a warchanter...bringing fury and rage to their kin by strong dummings.


Whoo...got some work before me *g*
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Dirigible
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Oh, the humanity!


« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2006, 01:18:23 AM »

Some comments by moi:

Prerequisites: You haven't specified what counts as a 'common language'. The only real common laguage in MN is Trade Tongue, and event hat is pretty limited inscope.

Skill List: As Nif suggests, there are perhaps too many physical skills on the list. The bard is supposed to be a sociable, magical character, not a roguish athlete, right?

Improved Spellcasting: Yikes. I don't they should get all those plus an enchantment spell. Perhaps they get to chose one or two spells per level, form that list plus Enchantment?

Art of Magic: Perhaps this intrudes too much into the Channeler's area of expertise?

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Many bards of the Chord are lawful because they do their job to inspire hope to everyone who is drowning in despair.

That's more of an argument for them to be good/i], not lawful Smiley
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smeagol
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« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2006, 05:33:01 AM »

As for the rules: I won't comment much, because I'm no d20 specialist. I only noticed that your version seems no more powerful than the one that is in the Tome of Sorrows (see pathoflegends.org).

I'd be very, very interested in further background development. I too don't think bards could have been "erased" that easily by the Shadow. Of course, there are only very few individuals that could deserve such a title, but I can picture the following:
- a commoner who lives in some remote community learns by himself to play an instrument (usually a flute because it's easy to carry and conceal), and develops a taste for telling stories. Or he is taught such arts by an elder. This skill goes unnoticed by most since the kid is a shepherd and plays his flute while away from any who could hear. And those who know see this a harmless. Later on, the kid becomes by himself a talented musician and/or storyteller, and his songs inspire hope and perhaps rebellion to those who hear them and propagate them (think of any resistance song during any wartime period). The now-grown young man then begins to wander the country-side, always in remote communities where there are no orc troops or legates to report, and he sings his songs and tells his tales in exchange for some food.

- very few disciples of the last bard scattered to the winds when the Shadow fell, and carefully kept the oral traditions of the Erenlander people (or may have hidden its texts in secret caches in case the worst happens to them). Forming a secret society, they secretly gather once a year in a predetermined place to exchange news and their creations. When they come to old age, some take a carefully-chosen child as an apprentice, and teach him their ways (usually this is an orphan, so no-one cares if the child leaves with the old man - and if the old man is denounced by his pupil, then at least his fellow bard have kept his knowledge, so not all is lost). This "bardic secret society" progressively becomes a part of the Chandrahaal, its members are the lorekeepers of oral traditions of the common people of Eredane, and the keepers of hope in their songs. At great risk, they travel Eredane under various guises, to research old songs of folklore and to carefully spread in far-off villages their songs and knowledge.

- dwarven bards are singing songs to keep the troops' morale high.

- elves, particularly Miransil, Caransil and Danisil, also have kept some bardic traditions, although those tend to decline in the Last Age due to the impending war. There are still some great bards in elven lands, who sing all kinds of songs, mostly sad ones about the loss of loved ones. Elves are an artistic people after all, and I can easily picture some Tolkien-esque contest of sad songs after a Pyrrhic victory, honoring the fallen ones. Of course battle songs are also known.

- halflings would know some peasant songs (for agrarian halflings) or travel songs (for nomadic halflings), each generation passing its songs to the next. Even halfling slaves might secretly whisper the songs of their people, to keep some hope and find the strength to survive their harsh captivity (and, given the "hedge magic" of the little folk, their innate ability spells might be activated only while singing their ancestral songs or whistling a tune - just a possibility)

- gnomes are known as excellent singers and to know all sort of songs and folk tales fromalmost any other people of Eredane (including orcs). There is even one gnome family that specializes in music and songs. These could perhaps be the last remaining (and not forced to hide) bards of all occupied lands.

- orcs could have their own battle criers, singing songs of blood and carnage to create the battle frenzy of orc berserkers. Special "bards", to be sure, but "bards" nonetheless...

Just a few ideas.
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smeagol
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« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2006, 05:48:29 AM »

- I also forgot to mention the remaining sarcosan freeriders, who surely still sing their old folk's songs aroung the firecamp at night, as these people stronlgy want to keep their lore and traditions. Songs and tales (and parables of the sorshef) are a good way to preserve and transfer a culture to the next generations.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2006, 06:39:23 AM by smeagol » Logged
Reideen
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To win, means to sacrifice.


« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2006, 07:25:32 AM »

Quote
- very few disciples of the last bard scattered to the winds when the Shadow fell, and carefully kept the oral traditions of the Erenlander people (or may have hidden its texts in secret caches in case the worst happens to them). Forming a secret society, they secretly gather once a year in a predetermined place to exchange news and their creations. When they come to old age, some take a carefully-chosen child as an apprentice, and teach him their ways (usually this is an orphan, so no-one cares if the child leaves with the old man - and if the old man is denounced by his pupil, then at least his fellow bard have kept his knowledge, so not all is lost). This "bardic secret society" progressively becomes a part of the Chandrahaal, its members are the lorekeepers of oral traditions of the common people of Eredane, and the keepers of hope in their songs. At great risk, they travel Eredane under various guises, to research old songs of folklore and to carefully spread in far-off villages their songs and knowledge.


Thats almost like I imagined The Chord


The Chord

Organization and goals

Most organizations tend to stick with themselves. While this is only half-true for the Chord they are much more unknown than most of the resistance groups in Eredane. They're more like friends who tend to share storys and songs with one another than a guild or a united resistance group. But actually there is a head on that group. A beautifull and talented woman called Millia Purethroat.
She has the ability to keep people together but she does not possess any abilities of leadership. Thats the reason why members are pretty much free to go where they want, if they at least show up on the very rare meetings. The meetings are mostly held in places like old ruins of towns, as long as they aren't infested with fell. In these meetings the different members tell what they have seen, what they have heard and what they composed. They also share surviving tips when they had problems in citys or towns. More than one bard has survived a spy of the shadow because he heard of the specific person by another bard. But more than one has died because he took the tips to lightly.
Unlike many channelers the chord is more focused on the history of literature than magic itself. They see their magic in the written words of men and try to save whatever novels or poems they can get to keep them save from the legates.
Rumors around some of the members tell that many only joined the chord because of beautifull Millia. She knows that to good, but she doesn't care as long as they are pure in their purpose. And if this purpose is to impress Millia because of love she is okay with that. In the end, emotions tend to bring out the best in a bard's heart. What she doesn't know is the fact that only a few really fell in love with her. Most of them just can't explain the feelings they have for her. Maybe they're similar to the feelings a child has to its mother, but they're not the same at all.


Millia Purethroat
She is the "head" of the Chord. Well noone has ever made her that but at some time all members started to go to her for help and now she is something like the leader. While she is more a keyring that keeps all keys together she isn't very skilled at fighting against the shadow so the chord is more passive than other resistance groups.
Her smile tends to be a very sad one. Every member of the chord notices this and some try to give her back her real smile by working as hard as they can. Others write poems about this sad smile and some few tend to ignore it. Not because they don't care but because they just can't stand it to see her unhappy.
A avatar of aradil once told her mistress
She is a very enigmatic person. I can't really describe what it is, but a strange air flows around her that inspires everyone around and brings out the will to give it your best. She tries to hear about everyones problems and to solve them. But even if she can't, most of the members are happy, she even tried. It is really strange...maybe she is no human at all. I can't say that for sure. And if she is, she will break under the pressure. I'm sure of it.


more to come...

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Nifelhein
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Whisper's Will


« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2006, 10:25:13 AM »

Hey Reideen!

Making the bard fill every role possible, which he does fill in the core rules, like being a channeler of sorts, somewhat roguish, mesh well with Ewredane's society and still have something of its own will hardly work, that is because you will be making some other class iin Midnight and not a Midnight bard. Wink

You would have to outline what the class is all about and how bards exist and live in Midnight, then go to the aspects it should focus on and egt started. Special weapon proficiencies, armor use, spells, isntrument or not, tiered abilities, gift exapnasions, class skills and all things would be evry very easily obtained after doing those two basic steps. Wink

If you absolutely must emulate the hermetic channeler ability for Midnight bards, then make it weaker and more basic, the version will probably have spells available to do the work if it needs and knowledge skills might do the trick well enough as well. a weaker version would either have less info (like a single sentence) or take more time or resources to get done (gather information after a day in the city, using esources up to X vp, determined by the info sought).

The snow Witch gets a single spell every two levls and all in a list, unless I am mistaken, this is what i think you may want to do with the bard, so if you do not have Sorcery and Shadow, go here Wink

One thing we may already outline is that we have three different lines for a bard: charm making (ie folk lore adept), musician and storyteller. Those are the three things you have to keep in mind for the class and its tiered abilities, I would also add imporvements over the previous abilities, but to do that you msut define what classes would qualify for th bard, or class combination. If you want it to be a charismatic channeler's area (liek the wizard and druid are for the other traditions) then leave anything it cannot get easily out or make sure you want it that hard.

For charms the first ability could increase all bonuses from charms by 1 (stackable with any feat or the like) and grant him a number of charms known equal to something (like Wisdom modifier, character level, knowledge (local) ranks - totalled) and get a new one every level in the class. Then he would be able to use a charm (which is a personal tool) and grant half the bonus of the chaarm to his allies within 30ft (round up, minimum 1), then he gets to grant them the full bonus, this bonus would be treated as if the character receiving was activating the charm himself, meaning lucky would get int here. Wink

It would not work with charms that do not grant a numerical bonsu though.

For stoytellers and musicians go with the charming voice, new gifts and a few focused choices, like using his perform (instrument) skill with any other instrument at a penalty (-2 for similar, -4 for different style -cords, drums and the like -  and -6 for instruments that are too alien or odd in nature), the storyteller could then get a choice of using a perform check instead of diploacy against an audience, they would have to be paying attention to his story and not be negotiating or directly avoid hearing the bard.

Those are a few of the possible lines, I think abrds in midnight are more of storytellers and travelers than entertainers, so they would be closer to spreading rumours and stories than making a big audience cry or apllaud his performances. This would change a lot the idea of how the class would turn out, for exaple.

I liked a lot the inspire leadership thing, but I do think the way it could be done sounds soo loose it will not have the requirements needed for the effect. If you want abrds taking tales from dead people, grant them access to the speak with dead spell, this would leave other spirits out of the equation, do not amke it a spell, though, more like a class ability, but then, it sounds sooo alien that i hardly see it being needed for the class.

Your chords society soudns a lot like one smeagol did a long while back, though that one was focused on knowledge instead. Wink
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Reideen
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« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2006, 03:21:55 PM »

Quote
Your chords society soudns a lot like one smeagol did a long while back, though that one was focused on knowledge instead.

hm...thats just coincidence.
I haven't read everything thats on ats.org and I think no one can blame me for that *lol* but if it is so much like smeagols sounds like something you might like *lol*
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Nifelhein
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« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2006, 04:44:22 PM »

I don't doubt it is a coincidence, but that means smeagol's insight might ring even more true to you. Anyway,  was known as the link man around AtS so here is a link to the piece i spoke of: Secret societies and the resistance a rather old post, the one i spoke of is the literacy society. Wink
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