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Author Topic: Heroic Paths, Crown of shadow help  (Read 4739 times)
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Devil
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« on: February 10, 2010, 11:02:51 AM »

Hi everyone Smiley
New guy here!

I am going to run Midnight as my first ever try out as a GM, and i need some help in figuring out which Heroic Paths to give players. (i don't want them meta gaming too much, as they seem to have a habit of doing so)

I think dragon blooded and shadow walker is a bit too powerful to give to any one player, and the one that gives divinations is just plain not going to be allowed.. Seer i think..  in fact a lot of the paths seem unbalanced when compared to eachother.
I am also going to run the CoS scenario and my players are a gnome rogue, erenlander channeler (spiritual), a dwarfen barbarian and another gnome with an as yet undecided class.

Can you give me some suggestions? Maybe paths that worked well in your campaign or when you (if you did) ran CoS Grin
Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Some paths i were thinking of was
quickened (the rogue), maybe speaker
Beast (for the barbarian or the gnome which i hope will be a defender) also Steelblooded
Faithful, sunderborn, maybe Warg(Because the channeler is spiritual and somewhat religious in personality, and wants to have a bond to nature)
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Pheros
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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2010, 11:21:43 AM »

Welcome to the Boards Devil.

There are a number of good paths, both in the books and on the site here...a few custom-made ones by posters are around.

In the past I've let the players pick out their paths...though it opens up the way for meta-gaming, the path is one of the defining points of a characters personality, and will change how they are played.  Even if it can be abused slightly, I think it might be beneficial to your players for them to choose.

I'd recommend strongly that one player take the Healer path...magic is rare and it's difficult to put a party back on its feet without access to healing spells (especially those that are safe to use...)

Good luck running the game.  There are a number of people who have posted their campaign notes from CoS up here, myself included.  Mine can be found here: Joe's Crown of Shadow Campaign.  My full notes are attached to a post near the end...

Good luck,
Joe
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Devil
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« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2010, 02:18:12 PM »

Hey Pheros thanks for the reply, greatly appreciated!

The reason why i am choosing their Paths is because i want them to look forward to the "treat" the path is. I also want it to be a mystery - slowly describing what is happening to them, so as to give them a sense of wonder about their character...  What do you think of my suggestions...

The dwarf is a kind, loyal and upstanding citizen, yet a barbarian and in his early, young days survived an encounter where a party he was in was ambushed by many orcs, yet ye managed to fell many and survive trekking home for many days - Ironborn`seems logical?
while the gnome rogue is more social, fun loving yet manipulative and sneaky. - Speaker is a good choice yeah?
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Doomed Hero
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« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2010, 03:11:45 PM »

Devil,

You're absolutely right that the paths aren't really balanced against each other. I came to that conclusion myself a while ago, which I discuss and try to fix in this thread

The new versions of the paths use the Pathfinder D20 rules, so not all of them will work if you're using the 3.5 system. (not much tweaking required if you decide you like them though)

As for the choices of paths, I disagree with Pheros regardig the Healer path, but then again, I like my Midnight to be harsh and unforgiving. I tend to make access to magical healing really scarce, and filled with consiquence. (Astiraxes, ect.)

The Seer path on the other hand, I find to be extremely beneficial in my game. it's basically a built in "plot-stick", and it gives the players a bit more control over their own destiny.

For your particular PC's, Dwarven barbarian screams Ironborn or Juggernaut to me (painless is also an option, but it's kind of an inferior path) The Rogue would benefit from the Speaker or the Quickened path, though Steelblooded Rogues are pretty terrifying, and abnormal, so neat.

As for your Defender, Giantborn (assuming the proper race) is darn good, as is Guardian.

Of course, these tend to be the obvious match-ups. There is something to be said for having paths that cover weaknesses or add options, instead of simply further boosting existing strengths.
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Devil
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« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2010, 03:32:36 PM »

Doomed Hero!
That is a fantastic thread. I really like how you reworked faithful and charismatic.. The charismatic just screams the rogue character - he wants to play a don juan, egocentric zorro kind of player, so he gets to now Smiley.
And the faithful rework makes it perfect both in spirit and, it seems, mechanics in terms of the channeler.

The last PC decided to go with a gnome wildlander (unconventional, just as he likes) and i was thinking of quickened, as i cannot see any other obvious choice for him (he is completely new to DnD)  What do you guys think of the last suggestion?
Your help is greatly appreciated!
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Pheros
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2010, 03:42:41 PM »

For a Wildlander, Naturefriend is a complementary choice, though more Role and less Roll playing.

DH, I like my MN gritty too, and similarly make spell access really really hard, which is why having something for wound recovery is a boon to a party...it also can give an otherwise non-combat oriented character a defined role in the party.  It also lets you as DM throw a little more in their way without TPK as often...though if you're the kind of DM where all the players have a second character already rolled out, then perhaps that's a bit grittier than even I go...heh heh

Devil, I like your idea of slowly revealing the Paths for a sense of wonder and surprise...it's a great idea!

Joe
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Doomed Hero
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« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2010, 06:17:21 PM »

DH, I like my MN gritty too, and similarly make spell access really really hard, which is why having something for wound recovery is a boon to a party...it also can give an otherwise non-combat oriented character a defined role in the party.  It also lets you as DM throw a little more in their way without TPK as often

That's a very good way of playing, too. In the later levels I don't mind healing magic being tossed around (pretty much by the time they get access to fireball, they aught to have some healing juice at their disposal. They're starting to play in the bigger leagues at that point.) But in the early levels, I pretty much don't allow healing magic. I find that it really makes the party think hard about consequences and longer term possibilities if they know that a Vardatch hit is going to take weeks to recover from. Those habits in the early game set the tone for later and even when the party can completely recover after a fight, they will still be more wary, which I like.


I really like how you reworked faithful and charismatic.. The charismatic just screams the rogue character - he wants to play a don juan, egocentric zorro kind of player, so he gets to now Smiley.

Glad you like it. Let me know how it works for you, as there has been very little playtesting of these new paths. I'd love some outside opinions. There are more paths in the works, but they haven't been finished yet.

The last PC decided to go with a gnome wildlander (unconventional, just as he likes) and i was thinking of quickened, as i cannot see any other obvious choice for him (he is completely new to DnD)

As Joe said, Naturefriend is a good choice. Adds a whole lot of versatility. Quickened is also good, though a bit more of a "selfish" path. (I end to prefer paths that add to party dynamic rather than just individual power.) My top vote for a crafty gnome wildlander would actually be the Tactician. It's a Path that almost forces party cohesion, and really rewards teamwork. The subtle question of why the character is so damn good at battlefield reactions can also make for fun story stuff.
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Saftsmurf
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« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2010, 11:45:12 AM »

I have been thinking of letting the PC:s sort of "pick" their path with a dream or something, if I ever get around to start continue my midnight campaign. I thought of letting a every gaming meeting in the beginning focus on one of the PC:s and put in some sort of choice situation for one PC at a time - for example, in a mystic dream he sees someone hurting another and have the opportunity to either help the victim (Healer) or kill the bad guy (some warrior stuff). In the meeting after he will slowly start to find out about his new gifts... The paths that the character could pick from would be picked from some that could fit. It would probably take a couple of meetings to see what fits the different PC:s, but some PC:s are usually pretty clear from the start.
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arnon
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« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2010, 03:03:36 AM »

Whenever i created a Midnight character, his/her heroic paths was tied directly into their personality, part of their background,  and who they are.

My recommendation would be to give the players a short blurb of a description of the Heroic Path (perhaps not even the name), and not what they get at each level.
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Kane
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« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2010, 07:37:00 AM »

I agree with Arnon taht the path should be part of the character's personality; who they are vice what they are. The most successful games I've played in have had characters who were painless, one with nature, etc.  The stats and abilities were a bonus, not the focus of the character.  The paths helped reinforce roleplaying vice power mongering. Giving the players the broad outline and then slowly revealing the abilities as they're gained (either directly from the books, the net books, or mods like Doomed Hero's) makes the game more enjoyable.

Kane
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